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17 Oct 2019 03:23 PDT
So...
"You obviously have no idea who you're watching."
Then maybe you could explain?
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17 Oct 2019 03:38 PDT
Re: So...
You know, I just read that journal of yours. Some normal person may think you're sick, and yes, you effectively are. Yet, I do not think it's a bad thing as long as you don't take a step further and actually do abuse or fuck a child. You see, while pedophilia, necrophilia, zoophilia and such are not fine nor good at all, I do think that as long as it doesn't become real, it's fine. And with that I mean that you don't actually fuck a kid, nor an animal, nor a corpse, nor such stuff. Just as I like lolis, which are just *drawings*, but I don't like real kids. And I can tell, as I've seen many naked kids in pools and beaches.
You know, there's a problem with the word "Pedophile" in english. We have two different yet associated words in spanish, "Pedófilo" and "Pederasta", but both translate to "Pedophile". A "Pedófilo" is someone like you, who just feels attracted by children but does no real harm, and "Pederasta" are the ones who do real harm by fucking a kid or abusing one. I was talking about those last ones.
That's why I hope you take back the "This one definitely means "I think pedophiles are evil." though.". I'm not stupid, as you may think, or as you seem to be as you assumed what I meant while I did not.
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17 Oct 2019 04:28 PDT
Alright, so you think pedophilia is evil in terms of action. I still think you're wrong there, and that was the major point.
While me and Tay follow the law, we are pro-contact pedophiles, meaning we want the law to change, and don't think sex with adults is inherently harmful. We disagree that it's always abuse or equivalent to rape.
I'm willing to debate these points, but the point is that Tay has always held these beliefs publicly, and I do find it amusing that you haven't noticed before.
Also, zoophilia has even less of a reason to be considered harmful, and necrophilia, as gross as it is, none at all. Dead bodies can not be hurt any further.
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17 Oct 2019 05:08 PDT
I think pedophilia it "evil" in terms of action with children who aren't conscious of this stuff, such as 10yo ~ 13yo/14yo. I think it's okay to have sex after that age only if consent is given by both parties. I say that because that age is when people start having sexual urges and are more conscious about sexuality, and I also think it's important to as it may define your sexuality or make you confused about it until you find it out.
Ah, about that. What the law tries to cover is sex with early-sexual-age people, as an adult can easily trick one of these into having sex with them, and that's abuse. That's why the law forbids sexual intercourse with minors up to 16 years old (in my country), as after that age, you're well aware about sexuality.
I honestly haven't. I've only and always followed him for his Pokemon Amie related work, not for his persona or affairs. He also seems to have gotten me wrong about the concept "Pedophile", as he blocked me, rip.
It is harmful indeed. It's a moral and ethical harm, which also hurts the image as a human being and society. Not even animals have sex with dead bodies except for that one specie which is so weird it's an exception. We're rational beings, that's why we see such paraphilias harmful just as rape is harmful, because if you think of rape the same way you think of necrophilia, then raping it's the same as mating, it's just sticking a dick on a vagina. You've got to see the rational parts, and that means the moral and ethical parts. Having sex with an animal is raping it, it won't give you consent, and not moving and letting you do it isn't consent, it's just being obedient as we taught them to be. And fucking a dead body is raping, too, as the dead body can't give its consent either. You should see it that way.
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17 Oct 2019 05:39 PDT
I'm more than happy to have a debate, though I do prefer to do my business out in the open where anyone can read it. Do you mind if I post our conversation (completely unedited) in a journal when we're done? Or we could move it right over to the journal comments for the next reply, I'd just post what was already said.
Tay blocked you because he's much closer to my side in all of this, and doesn't want to argue. On the other hand, I'm fine with arguing.
The fact is that these things that you're stating as obvious facts are debatable, and I disagree with them. Tay does too, but I can only really speak for myself.
Puberty starts a lot closer to 10 than 14, so that's when sexual urges really start. However, that's ultimately irrelevant. The fact that abuse and deception is possible, or even easier than it would be with an adult, doesn't mean that all sex between adults and children is abusive, or involves deception.
To claim that all sex with children is abuse, and harms them requires evidence that I just haven't seen. Even very young children may be interested in sex for reasons other than having a hormonal sex drive.
By harm, I mean actual harm. A living being being in some sort of pain, emotional, physical, whatever. Dead bodies are incapable of feeling pain. They are mere objects. The only people that might be hurt (and only then because of their own moral ideas) is the family of the deceased, and what they don't know literally cannot hurt them. Better yet, there are many cases where it would be impossible for the family to know, so there's no possibly at all of anyone actually getting hurt. I'd like to stress that I'm not in any way a necrophile, and death makes me sad more than anything. However, I think an honest evaluation would show that necrophile action is entirely harmless. There's no one left to rape.
In terms of animals, there's no evidence at all that they are by bestiality in cases that I would consider "consensual." I think that body language absolutely can be used for consent, and there's nothing the animal needs to know besides the fact that it feels good for them. Because, it does feel good for them. There are plenty of sex acts which are mutually pleasurable when preformed between humans and non-human animals.
The idea that animals would somehow feel pressured into letting humans be intimate with them is frankly ridiculous. Dogs get mad if you try to take a toy away. They are absolutly able to make their preferences known. The attempt to project human psychological phenomena on to non-humans is laughable. Also, there's a lot more to bestiality than men fucking bitches. What about male dogs, and giving them handjobs, blowjobs, or letting them fuck you? How can that in any way be construed as raping the dog?
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17 Oct 2019 06:57 PDT
I'd rather this to remain between us, as it's not a debate, but my opinion about it. I was just trying to get to you just so I don't gain enemies. I know it's stupid, but I don't want any enemies of any kind. I'm a soldier, so I know what having enemies means.
He could just have sent me a PM. Blocking straightly is dumb. I'm on his page for his content, not for his tastes. I don't relate a person with its work. However, I'd appreciate if you talked to him.
Sexual urges start at 12 or 13 years old, as that's when female genitalia starts developing, and 14 to 15 for male genitalia, if I remember correctly. That's why countries like Japan have their minimum consent age law stablished at 13. And yes, but it's the same as everything. Just because not all of the cases are rape or abuse it doesn't mean the law should be abolished. Just because not everyone is gonna rob a bank won't make them take down the law that forbids and punishes heists. It's illogical.
There may be kids who are curious about it, but even so when they try it they feel nothing or even pain if their genitals haven't begun developing, and that has been studied. And even so, it's an extremely rare case to find one who is truly interested or curious about sex at very young ages. It's just part of our nature to not even think about that at such age.
Ethical and Moral harm are actual harm, as we are rational beings. Psychologic harm is the same kind of harm, as there are no psychologic harm for animals but those who suffer a genetic disease such as down syndrome. And, honestly, I feel it sickening to read that you're defendind necrophilia. We're rational beings, and as such, making such thing harms us in en ethical and moral way. That's just like saying murdering it's fine, because it's just an action, which is killing someone. You cannot simplify such a thing in such way. And even if a dead person cannot feel pain, it's still non-consensual sex. You can rape someone without hurting them, such as sedating them. There doesn't need to be pain for it to become rape. We are rational beings, and that fact alone is enough to see what is good and what is not, and having sex with a dead person is not good in any way.
Actually, let me tell you respectfully that you have no idea about it. Animals don't feel good when having sex. Well, only two species do, which are Dolphins and Apes, but the rest don't. When they have sex it's for having offspring, that's an animal instinct, and they feel awful when doing so. Dogs, for example, feel an awful lot of stress when mating. Even when they're "fucking" someone's leg or a cushion, it's not because they feel good, but rather because they feel stressed and look for a way to release that stress, which is mating. But that makes them stop being stressed, it doesn't make them feel good. Otherwise, they'd masturbate just as Dolphins or Apes do. I can tell all of this because I used to work as a vet's assistant some years ago. Domestic animals don't know consent, as all they've been taught to do is being obedient. It doesn't matter if you harm them, they'll be obedient. An example is when you hit a domestic dog because it has done something you find wrong. It won't bite back, but feel repressed and scared, because it has been taught to be obedient and submissive to its human friend. So yes, when you fuck an animal, you're raping it, or rather forcing it.
Dogs get mad when you try to take a toy away from them, but what happens when you stablish your dominance over it? That's right, they obey. They can't say if they'd like you to fuck them or not, they're not rational enough to decide over such point. And, please, don't be ridiculous. Saying that giving a dog a blowjob isn't raping the dog is just as stupid as saying that just because I sucked someone's dick without them wanting me to isn't rape either. "Rape" is literally "non-consensual sexual activities", that includes from a handjob to penetration.
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17 Oct 2019 19:35 PDT
I don't think when the body physically develops is really terribly relevent to when the sex drive starts. There are many parts of puberty, and they happen at different times, in a different order for different people. One thing for females that is often considered the start of puberty is their first period, which really does often happen at about the ages of 10-11.
I'm not sure why you seem to think that having "undeveloped" genitals would somehow make sex not pleasurable. Sexual pleasure, and even orgasms seem to be possible at any age. I have an (online) freind who was sexually active starting at the age of 5, and it was definitely pleasurable for him.
Obviously, it's not right to try to put a penis in a whole too small to accommodate it, but there are many other sexual acts that can be done between people of radically different sizes.
Your analogy is frankly complete shit. A "heist" is the same thing as a robbery, so it's obviously bad in every circumstance. When pedophilia isn't rape, it's literally just sex, and sex shouldn't be illegal. I think it's absolutely possible to make sex between adults and children legal, while keeping rape illegal.
I honestly don't understand the "ethical harm" argument. Basically, it seems like circular reasoning. "It's wrong because it harms the person doing it because it's wrong." You have to establish that there's a reason for necrophilia to be considered wrong in the first place. Your rape anology falls flat, because it's very likely that the victim will experience psychological harm for the sole reason that they were raped. There is no victim with necrophilia. Dead is as harmed as it's possible to be. After that, the course is an object.
I've heard this nonsense about dolphins and apes being the only animals able to feel pleasure from sex before, and I even got somebody to send me their sources. Turned out it was absolute BS. Here's one actual source that totally debunks that claim: http://sci-hub.tw/https://doi.org/10.1016/j.applanim.2009.02.012 If that link doesn't work, you should at least be able to see the abstract here: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S... which is enough to show the "only apes and dolphins" claim as laughable.
Domestic animals can be very willful. You really have to back up your claims with evidence if you're saying that they'll just let anything happen to them if it's their human doing it. Animals are not obedient machines. Also, they can often initiate sexual activities, which throws that idea right out the water.
Yes, they don't "understand" sex in the same way humans do, but that doesn't mean that they're somehow traumatized by it. Also, there's absolutely no need to try to establish dominance over an animal to have sex with them. They show every sign of actually wanting the sex, and enjoying it.
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18 Oct 2019 03:35 PDT
Of course it is. People start having interest in sex when their first sexual urges appear, which are produced by hormone injection the body produces while their genitals start developing. For females it starts earlier, I think it starts at 13yo and ends at 15 or 16 yo. Add two years to each for males.
Wtf? How are you even sexually active at that age? Poor childhood of his... Also, I was talking about females. I don't know if it works any different for males, didn't really come across anything about them.
It's a valid hyperbole. You're simplifying things too much. "Pedophilia is just sex", well, if you think it that way, rape is also just sex. We living beings have a natural instinct, and sexual instincts at early ages aren't present at all. As with everything, there're exceptions, such as people with disorders. So no, sex with kids won't and shouldn't be legal whatsoever. What should be legal is sex with teenagers, but not kids. Remember the age range (Kids 5 ~ 12, teenagers 13 ~ 18).
You should read about ethics, then. It's a part of our human being. I repeat that rape is sex without one of both parties' consent. A dead person can't give you any consent. We humans have respect for those who have deceased, we let those who have died rest once and for all. Having sex with them is the worst thing you could do to any person. It's just ethics, and ethics are part of our being. It's the same as stealing a poor person's bread. It's just taking something from someone, but it's way worse to steal from a poor person than from a rich one, isn't it? Know why? Ethics. And no, my analogy doesn't fall flat, as you can't harm someone who doesn't realize it's been harm, given my Sedated Rape analogy.
Hm, that is interesting indeed. I shall keep it in my mind next time I hear about it.
Well, if you try to have sex with a wild animal, it will rip your dick off before killing you. Only domestic animals let us do what we want to them, as long as we feed them and give them some attention and affection. You could search it up.
They're not traumatized, but they don't enjoy sex. They enjoy masturbation, as a way to relief stress, but not sex. When they've got sexual urges to mate, they become really stressed, and mating is the only way to relief that stress. It's their anatomy. They don't show any sign of wanting the sex nor enjoying it at all. For them, you sucking their dick is equal to they cleaning it. They're not lustful as we are.
You know, as far as I like debating, this isn't a very comfortable theme to debate about for me. Talking with a robot about humanity is useless, just as it's useless to talk about ethical codes about someone who lacks it. No offence, though that's not really offensive in any way.
I understand your pov, though, so that that I gained from this. Yet, I will keep mine. We are live beings, and live beings are made to reproduce with those of their same specie and hood (I mean, adulthood, teenhood and such xd).
Thank you for this, and please, ask Tay to delete my comments on his page. I don't want anything to do with that.
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